Surfski Knowledge Base

Saturday Paddle 9:30!!
allipp01
08/29/15 #17889

OK, I just spoke to Duncan. He will be at Squalicum Beach with his trailer at 9:30. You must have experience in these conditions as well as all safety gear if you want to hop on the Howat shuttle service!

John Rybczyk
08/29/15 #17890

Waves are big off of Marine Park right now and the rain has abated for a bit. Winds out of the SSE. Fun for some for sure but, solid skill set required. Rescue from fellow paddlers would be difficult.

Nicholas Cryder

08/29/15 #17892

On the ferry to Orcas Islands to see my folks, and the conditions are simply huge. Stay safe out there…

Kevin Olney

08/29/15 #17893

I turned around at Bvld Pk and paddled back to MP. John R bailed at Cornwall and is back as well.

KO

Nicholas Cryder
08/29/15 #17894

Just got word of an over turned boat in the Rosario Straight. Ferry is assisting coast guard in search for missing people. Doesnt look good.

John Rybczyk

08/29/15 #17896

Well, that was exciting. I made an early decision to come in at Cornwall beach (from Marine Park) because I wasn't entirely certain that I was going to successfully shoot the gap into Squalicum. Only problem being that I did not have a ride from Cornwall beach back to my car. However, upon paddling in, there was Larry B., with a car, a rack, and straps. I asked him how it came to be that he happened to be right there, right then when I needed a lift and he said that he was guided by the patron saint of dumbasses to come and get my dumb ass! True enough! Anyway, when we all reconnoitered at Marine Park at around noon we were treated to a spectacular scene. I don't think I've ever seen the bay like that. There were actually surf board surfable waves breaking offshore of Marine park, perpendicular to the wind. Huge, huge stuff.

John M. Rybczyk

michael.medler@…
08/29/15 #17897

Well, that was interesting. There was a wee bit of eastern component once we got past the drydock that changed fun surfing into death grip paddling. I was thinking about the buddy system as I paddled by my buddies Rybczyk, Scoggins and Lipp as they swam around near their boats The most helpful thing I could think to do was yell “get back in your boat.” Steve was actually the victim of a microburst that transitioned into a small waterspout as it passed over us. I will vouch for whatever story he tells. I saw him lifted straight up out of the boat till his leash arrested his vertical momentum. The guy clearly doesn't weigh enough. If I am not mistaken, he spent the next few seconds hiding under his boat. The most helpful thing I could do was paddle over to ask him if he still had a paddle, as it seemed likely to be about 500 feet up at that point.

Steve Scoggins
08/29/15 #17898

It was definitely interesting to go airborne. I'm glad someone saw it, just to affirm that it looked like it felt. Definitely a good leash test. I vouch 100% for the Mocke leash. It hung tough through a series of strong tugs. It was good times out there.

Steve

paul clement

08/29/15 #17899

The Lake Whatcom downwinder was unbelievable. Blowing hard, gusting harder and rolling like a freight train.

David Scherrer
08/29/15 #17901

I trust everyones back and accounted for……Everyone from our group is OK. Sounds like Reiver's group including John and Mike M. are OK.
Haven't heard from Dunc.

DS

David Scherrer
08/29/15 #17902

Interesting….Cherry point gauge registered winds gusts to 62 mph! That was around 12 30 today.
Winds are presently dropping, adv. 25, gusts to 34, presently shifting south.
D.

Steve Scoggins
08/29/15 #17903

Everyone was accounted for and happy.

Steve

Dennis Mowry

08/29/15 #17904

David I was thinking it was like your description of the Champs race, as far as the water conditions. The wind was the biggest problem especially trying to make it back inside towards the wind line to the right rather than missing the harbor entrance and getting blown to Marietta. Surfing right as the wind was blowing left. You could of borrowed my V10 since you sold your R.

Biggest tragedy today was Bob's boat busting loading on the trailer.

David Scherrer
08/29/15 #17905

Had the Evo 2 out today running it through it paces….Great big water and wind boat, impressed.
What happened to Bob's boat, would that be Bob Macbeth?
D.

Yikes] Re: Saturday Paddle 9:30!!
Reivers Dustin
08/29/15 #17895

Well said John. Thank goodness everyone had some large water skills. Big fast clean waves off Marine Park, but just inside the bay past the dry dock it turns to chunky monkey. I guess I wasn't the only one to take a swim. Those cross-hatch monster waves were bugger, but what nailed me was a big gust of wind. Just took the paddle, I could keep both hands on the paddle or I could stay on the boat. Not much of a decision. The boat immediately sailed to the end of the leash instantly. Typical fiddling around getting boat and leash set right for re-entry.

Yesterday Duncan commented: so, you're taking your brand new, never been wet S1-R out for first shakedown in monster conditions. What could possibly go wrong.

Shit ahoy mateys. Nice slippery mold release wax on the seat. Not used to single footwell, not used to having a dang footstrap. Not used to this boat at all. The boys asked if I brought champagne to christen it with. Since I didn't bring any they were going to pee on it. No worries men, I peed all over myself the whole ride. Boat is christened.

rd

duncanhowat
08/29/15 #17906

Read Reivers account of the days activity at dinner to my 5 year old granddaughter, and she asked did he really pee in his boat the whole way all the time? I said yep I think so. And thus the day ended and all is well.

Marc Fuhrmeister
08/29/15 #17907

I'm happy to hear Steve vouches for his leash, looks like I'm in the market for a new one. I'm fortunate that it failed getting out of the shore break at the end and not anywhere else. This might have been a very differently worded post. Hell of a day!!!

-Marc

Saturday Paddle 9:30…thoughts on yesterday
allipp01
08/30/15 #17909

First of all, I think yesterday was a great opportunity for us to get out in winter like storm conditions while the bay water was still warm and pleasant. I, along with Steve, Reivers and possibly John R all got blown off our boats and ended up in the water.

Here are some observations I have of being in the water when the wind is gusting above 50 mph:

1) A surfski will roll and wrap the leash around it as it rolls. If you're on the downwind side of it, it will roll right over you. An easy to get to release is needed, otherwise you'll end up like a trussed pig with your leash wrapped around the boat and you pinned to it. I had my leash around my knee, and I reached down, unhooked the velcro and held on for dear life! I'm not sure how easy a waist release would be to get off in this situation as I've never used one. (Editor's note: As a waist leash user, my experience has been that I do not get wrapped up and I have never been trussed to my ski, so no need to unhook - which in extreme conditions is a very risky thing to do)

2) Once you're free of the leash wrap, you must hold on to the leash with your hand and, at this point I'm not sure if you want to try leash up again or not. I was hesitant to trust doing an underwater wrap of the velcro around my knee, so I just held on for dear life!

3) Your remount will be different than anything you've done. I usually get the boat situated by facing it downwind, climb in and off I go. Not gonna happen when the wind is that strong. The boat will be perpendicular to the wind and you'll have to pull yourself hand over hand to the boat using your leash, then climb on from the upwind side. My preferred mounting side is the left, but that was the downwind side, and when I got there, the boat just kept blowing over me, so I ducked under and mounted from the right. MAKE SURE YOU CAN REMOUNT FROM EITHER SIDE!

4) If you let go of your leash, your boat will be gone gone gone in seconds! Seriously I'd guess it would blow away at nearly the speed of the wind, which at 50 mph is 5/6 of a mile in a minute.

5) My first remount was fine, but I pulled my legs in the boat, tried to get leashed up right away and fell back in. My suggestion is to keep your legs out and get your head back in the game, maybe even take a few strokes to get the boat turned in the right direction (using your legs kicking as a rudder), then get your leash on, then off you go.

6) An outrigger, as long as the rigging doesn't break is a much easier craft to control in those kind of winds.

Steve Scoggins
08/30/15 #17911

I concur….kind of. I'm not willing to risk taking off my leash. Then again, I wasn't in your boat at your moment of clarity, so ultimately I'm not saying anything aside from “good job”. I prefer to untangle the boat by swimming under it and then let the wind reverse the tangle. Easy to say from here, when you're not wrapped up against a boat that's pulling you and pushing you under water. Alan, you are now officially the strongest and boldest man I know if you took your leash off in those conditions and managed to hold on.

I couldn't agree more that dialing in both sides for remount is essential. I spent extra time ducking under and positioning the boat to a more favorable spot instead of just getting back on.

Excellent post Alan. I think it wise to suggest that people practice remounts with a tangled boat. Tedious work, but its a likely scenario.

Steve

njcooksey@ymail.com

08/30/15 #17912

The mocke pro leash has a leg quick release so you can leave the leg strap attached.
The stern leash solves the twisting problem, lets the boat rotate and not care so no need to disconnect.
When I used a stern leash, I still had a quick release pull on my leash belt. I copied my North Water sea kayak tow belt.

We had pretty good wind down here in Seattle. 35-40kts. We did a couple laps by shilshole, about 20kms total. The second lap a thirty foot CG patrol boat came by and checked on me as I was paddling down wind. I gave them a thumbs up and they took off. Unfortunately they kicked up a huge wake which combined with the wind waves and broke over me and knocked me out of my ski. They were a way downwind by then and not looking back but at least I had no issue getting back in and going again. I overshot the take out and had a bit of upwind grind to finish the day. We had a couple of newer guys come out and they wisely dressed well and took a very inside line on the run and had a good time. All in all a good day.

Leashes…
bill
08/30/15 #17913

Leashes…( i can’t seem to write anything thats not long winded). I can’t think of a more important piece of safety equipment. I have been somewhat obsessed with them since getting into the sport and seeing what was on offer. I have gone threw a number of designs and after having a poorly thought out design contribute to a bad day on the water, i have settled on one that works for me.

I can’t imagine unclipping myself in a blow from my ski leash. Not without another leash to clip on first, like climbing… clip in before you un clip. I also can’t imagine being out there without a paddle leash. It was all i could do at times just to hang on to the paddle. If i was relying on it as my paddle to ski ski leash, loosing the paddle could easily mean loosing the ski. That system makes no sense to me.

I hate having leash line in the cockpit with me. Even when practicing it gets tangled and in my Epic it gets tangled on the bailer lever as well. Velcro has a limited lifespan around saltwater and sand plus the cords are a joke. There have been so many reports of them braking or velcro failing ending in a number of deaths i can’t believe anyone relies on these things.

I see no reason that a leash should be anything less than bomber strong. Some argue that you can get hurt by a leash that won’t brake. I can’t envision any circumstances that i want to be separated from my ski except in the surf and a quick release fixes that. Your ski is your life raft. You can drape yourself over it keeping most of your body out of the water adding enormously to survive time in cold water and you are far more visible with your ski than just your head out of the the water. Your chances of surviving in cold water without your ski are drastically reduced.

I want my leash out of the cockpit, super strong yet able to absorb a big shock. As Allen mentioned its sometimes your not on the right side of the ski for an optimal remount. Even though i can remount on both sides I’m a bit better on the right side of the ski for some reason. Having the ability to orient the ski to what ever side i want is a big deal to me so having my leash on a runner allows me to go to the stern, let it blow down wind and throw the stern over to the side that works best for a remount.

In the end i use a wast belt attached to a spectra leash line coiled inside silicone tubing that stretches from 4’ to 8’+. That is on a runner that goes from the stern handle and attaches to the bungee on the back deck. The bungee has been replaced with 1/4” spectra bungee of 1500 lbs braking strength. Any load on the spectra bungee is spread between 4 separate glassed in deck bungee attachment points. At the moment i am using a locking carabiner to attach it to the wast belt or it can be switched to a snap shackle if needed. I wish i could find a smallish snap shackle with a release lock or a small auto locking beaner that will hold up to saltwater over time….. Ideas?

So far at least in practice i have never been tangled in the leash nor has it been tangled on the ski. It stays out of the way and self tends while remounting. It will wrap around the ski if the ski rolls but the thick and stiff silicon tubing doesn’t tangle or get caught under anything like the rudder and is very easy to handle. With the double shock absorption of the leash and decking bungee it can take a big load before it tugs hard.

So in the end i have a bomber strong running leash that lets me move from the bow to the stern freely, control what side of the boat i want to be on to remount, doesn’t tangle around me or the ski, isn’t in the cockpit and is quick release when needed.

In no way am i suggesting that this is the way it should be, on the contrary. Im just posting this as i think most leashes are a joke and could get someone killed… and have. I’m open to ideas, constructive criticism and would love to see what other people have done in the way of leashes.

With people that don’t want or can’t have a runner, the spectra bungee replacement is i think a smart idea. It makes a very solid place to anchor too if using a wast belt. A length of it can works as a leash itself and is WAY stringer than off the shelf leashes. Bungee In the cockpit it is easer to untangle (but longer) than that glorified phone card stuff. It stretches 3-1.

Sorry for the long post but after a day like yesterday and Allen’s post this stuff is fresh in my mind.
Here are two pictures of my setup on my Stellar S18s. I have it on my other skis as well.

Bill

Reivers Dustin
08/30/15 #17914

Really great discussion thread. You guys hit my main stuff. I fiddled with orienting the boat, but gave up it and got in from my less favored side, no problem. When I went over the leash went tight as a piano wire. In my mind no leash equals no boat (in those conditions).

My re-entry is usually a measured thing. I rest on my belly on the boat, then rest in the seat side-saddle, then rest in the seat with legs out. Each stage is checking gear, checking body, checking the area, conditions, etc. The new footstrap thing messed me up, since getting feet in became a big deal. Uh, by the way: sidesaddle with feet upwind.

I saw a facebook post with a surfski leash from ankle to front of the 'ski. Might be better idea for the tangle factor. LB has the trick “rotating belt” leashed to back end which addresses tangles.

I talked with Dennis about this next one: paddle leash vs. boat leash. He's got both, but the paddle leash is just to his PFD. Some years ago Morris said it well: leash paddle to boat, then I have control of what I'm connected to. I preferred that for years because during assists, I could use both hands as I pleased. But JD (and others) reject this and want body to boat leash. This means your paddle is free to leave you. I'm always going to wonder about this. I really trust my grip on the paddle. So my logic can take me either way. Just for grins I've tried both leashes and that was not my happy place. As I've said before on here: when it gets really rough, if you don't need it to save yourself, then every string, button, strap and buckle conspires to trap you.

Something Alan said in an earlier post should be emphasized: any surfski to surfski assist has very low value in those conditions. OC maybe, but 'ski would probably have to get off (trusting your leash) in order to help a brother paddler. Just too rough.

One more thing: I could not paddle upwind. Tried my best because I was too far out. With that slow speed, the rudder gave no helm. So I gave up and paddled broadside on with both feet out. Had to keep the upwind blade down low, since the wind would just pull me out of the boat. It was a treat to figure all these fiddly bits out while laughing in the face of death.

rd

njcooksey@ymail.com
08/30/15 #17915

Another option from the world of sea kayaks is the wrist to paddle leash. We use an elastic cord loop that goes from paddle to your wrist. We leave it attached and wrapped around the shaft and then just unwrap and slide your wrist through the loop when needed. A few inches of slack is enough to let you remount but not get tangled.

bill
08/30/15 #17916

I use a short leash of small diameter bungee from the paddle to the D-ring on the front bottom of my think PFD. Its only as long as i can hold my paddle out and move it all around without any tension.

I can set it on my lap or drop it in the water without it being tight. It doesn’t go tight or interfere with remounting. I don’t notice it while paddling at all. Iw was invaluable in my “adventures at sea” as i could just drop it and use both hands on the tangled rudder, or have it stay with me while using the radio and holding on to my ski. You can call me Mr. Leash as i have my paddle leashed to me, my ski, my radio and phone…. oh, and hat. none of which get in my way at all…. well, unless i want to turn my hat around in a stiff breeze.

Im interested in this “rotating leash”?… do tell.

Bill

Steve Scoggins

08/30/15 #17917

Another consideration here…..I'm of the opinion that a leash, whether a commercially made one or homemade with Spectra or parachute cord or whatever, has a relatively short life expectancy. Do you leave your leash on the boat, exposed to sun and the elements regularly? Probably better get a new one every year or so. If you've had a few serious pulls on it, it did its job. Thank it, and get a new one.

I know, it sounds a bit extreme, BUT most safety items are required to be replaced after a certain number of uses regardless of appearance. Parachute cords and climbing rope are good examples. Bike helmets are supposed to be replaced even after one small crash, etc, etc, etc.
Steve

bill

08/30/15 #17918

Agreed on some sort of replacement schedule.

But Spectra/ Dyneema is remarkably UV stable, abrasion resident (for line), chemical resistant and is little effected by flex ( unlike Kevlar). It is being used as standing rigging replacement on sailboats now and has proven itself in the tropics with an expected 10 plus year lifespan. It's only real achilles heal is heat. It's remarkable stuff really, and cheep… Ish.

Bill

Larry <lbussinger@…>

08/31/15 #17929

Rotating belt….I have a static line that goes from an anchor behind the seat to an anchor at the aft of the boat. My leash is attached to this with a ring that will slide the full length, thereby taking some of the shock out of the pull and aligning the boat down wind. The leash is attached to me by a loose fitting belt. If I rotate in the water, the belt just spins on me so I don't get wrapped up. And I don't have the problem of getting my feet tangled. I think there is a picture of one of my set-ups in the photos album.

Larry B

kathleen petereit

09/10/15 #17997

I do the same thing as Bill and have a small short bungee cord from my paddle to my pfd. Then have the body to boat leash. I have done many practise remounts in big waves and the two leashes never tangled.

On our last downwind when someone was in trouble we found that it was hard to hear the person calling for assist on the vhf due to the wind. When he pushed the conatct button that rings us it was loud and clear like an old school fire alarm and alerted us to stop and listen. We have our contacts on a group setting so that the person in trouble can push on surfski group and it rings all of us at once so no matter how spread out we are we all stop.

Kathleen

Reivers Dustin
09/11/15 #17998

You guys are tight up there. It used to be like that here, but the group is huge with people launching all hours of the day with different put-ins and take-outs going on. There are new folks showing up that I don't recognize. I think there's a point where we moved from small tight group to crazy kids out to play.

I would like to see us all set our DSC radios up for group ring. I've got several contacts in mine, but so far no one has heard when I did the direct contact feature. My MMSI is 338100912.

I'm pleased to notice that when any group of us go, there is always a head count and check-in at the end. Even though some don't seem to feel strongly about it, there are many who really count heads, ask about where everyone is, etc.

At risk of ranting: one-on-one rescue in big water is last resort, very dangerous to both. If you are a master on the water, this is not about your great stability stuff. If you are learning, those tough guys can't carry you like you might think. Group paddle just means someone knows where you went (maybe). Best plan: don't go past your level. Last defense: pack VHF radio.

rd

saturdays weather
duncanhowat
08/31/15 #17921

Just for future reference, according to Cliff Maas, (UW weather guy) Sat's blow was the strongest summer storm on record, EVER.