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===== The future of racing? Let's discuss... and do something BIG. =====

**Nicholas Cryder** 12/12/21 #30680

Looks like Deception Pass 2021 was one for the books. Congrats to everyone who organized this event, volunteered and participated. I am happy to hear everyone had a good-ish time while it lasted. I am only partly sad I missed it as I get ready to go paddle in shorts and a tank top here in SoCal.

I think it's fairly obvious we're at a pretty important inflexion point in our sport, and I'd like to bring up something for the greater US racing community to discuss / chew on that I personally feel could make or break the future of what we think our sport is, or is not. I offer the following as a guy who really truly wants what is best for our sport, not just my adrenal glands. I also offer this as a guy who raced in some races I wasn't ready for, I just didn't know what I didn't know.

Our growth in numbers is deceptive. Many of you who were cyclists in the 90's and early 2000's might remember when the sport went from being a niche sport for type-A weirdos in neon lycra to a mainstream sport for type-A weirdos in neon lycra. Switch lycra for neoprene goodies from Giant Fish, and I think the correlation for growth potential is very clear.

What helped make that transition feasible was a governing body that for all its flaws, politics and egos still managed to keep the sport accessible for beginners without diluting what it should be for the qualified pros. It also unburdened the race organizers by making the rules fair, insurance accessible and decision making cut and dry. Part of that decision making was a crude but effective ranking system that started with "citizen" (aka beginner) and moved into categories from 5 (novice) to 1 (elite). The elite level races were exactly that; brutal ascents, high speed descents and action packed sufferfests that were good for the racers, race organizers, sponsors, fans and most of all the sport itself. Local races were generally open to all, national races might be category 3,2, 1 and Pro. International races were reserved for pros and category 1 / national team participants and invite only. Regional reps kept track of race results, and racers petitioned for upgrades based on their results. There were forced upgrades when gifted but greedy athletes became obvious sanbangers. The reps had the final say. There were rules, and people were accountable. I am not sure if there was a system for grievances, I was just a kid and focused on racing and winning back my entry fees.

I believe our beloved open ocean sports (here defined by me as OC, SS and SUP) has something for everyone. It's fun for beginners, novices, barnacles and the offshore super stars. I am all for having fun, beginner friendly events. I am not in favor of forbidding elite athletes who have made a long term commitment to their sport defined exclusively by the capabilities of beginners. Likewise, I am not for having beginners in harm's way at events that are suitable for developed paddlers who have been vetted and earned that startline privilege… And yes, I am asserting that racing is a privilege, not a right. Go try to line up at the Tour De France or drop your boat in at the America's Cup and tell me what happens.

I am not sure where we go from here, but I am willing and desire to help because if we don't, others with no connection to our sport or ethos will make decisions for us.

Let's discuss, and do something BIG.\\
\\
Nicholas Cryder\\
**Reivers Dustin** 12/12/21 #30681

Compelling logic, but humans are non-linear. IMHO the sport is not quite mature enough. A natural start would be something like the boat classification system grown by Sound Rowers. They did a lot of work developing this with a bunch of the work done by our own LB. (A long time ago.) But that doesn't address skill. Although there is a pretty good selection process. I'm not aware of any serious losses during an organized "all human powered" event. Most newbies get a bad scare and recognize their exposure.

Sadly that will probably be the driver. If there are losses, then there will be real motive to layer oversight. But oversight is expensive. No question it will happen someday.

rd

**Eric Grossman** 12/12/21 #30682

Progressing as an elite bike racer requires earning and moving through the ranks from Cat 5 to 4 to 3, etc but there’s no drowning factor. While on flat days this may be moot, but on a day forecasted to gale or have any sketch factor, maybe we should have some honest/established category designation to choose course, whether to go, groupings, buddy up, etc. I suspect most paddlers could self define and organize into categories well enough to reduce a lot of risk. As friends, we could also weigh-in whether so-and-so is ready for the bigs and help define the groupings, that would probably take care of most of us.

Personally, I probably take a few too many risks, but I do tend to follow criteria that makes sense to me. I examine the weather forecast and know there is error in the models regarding the timing, wind speed and direction of several hours, 5-15kts, 10-20 degrees (respectively), I know what the tide forecast is, and if it’s really nuking I tend to stay close enough to shore to swim it if I have to (I swam competitively and am in awe of folks who paddle - esp in cold conditions and are not confident swimmers). I listen to my instincts and don’t go when I’m doubting my abilities or energy. This all will help to minimize risk for what you can control, but there is always risk and/or the unexpected injury or equipment malfunction.

Yesterday I didn’t have enough time to race DP, but Erik W and I had a blast on Bellingham Bay, not as big and long period waves as Denise’s video showed but the same phenomena-dying SE wind but good waves from the typical SSE abruptly became howling SSW gale ripping water off the surface producing steep, endless and chaotic corduroy stacking up between the red can and MP. After a slog to the tunnel we quickly turned toward Eliza when we saw the wind change. We stuck together. A few gusts tested us but at least personally I can say I’ve been practicing in the high tide slop just for these times. One wave on the 3rd or 4th lap back out literally picked up my boat and spun me around - felt like a quarter turn but was probably a fraction of that - so I went in. Today was a lot more manageable but certainly a lot more was going on in my brain processing what went down yesterday. Listen to yourself and be honest, there will be many more epic days.

Stay well and treat every day as a new one with a whole new set of conditions.\\
Eric

**Duncan Howat** 12/12/21 #30683

Or the debacle like this will drive liability insurance out of any race organizers or group right out of town. Unless you go "bare" and risk your house and car and everything else you have. I believe the insurance for SKI to Sea is $20,000 plus, and is absolutely due to the two water legs. But it's real insurance. Based on my court experience in the state of washington, which is the worse, we're a plaintiff attorneys pure heaven with a license to steal. Sorry if I affended any in this group, but I know Simon is not. liability releases in this type of event generally are not successful. There a warning, thats about it. Also on a side note a parent cannot sign away a minors right to sue some day. What does seem to work is the Carter speech before the Gorge this year, and 40 percent dropped out. By the way the little cost of the coast guard MH-65 Dolphin Heilo is about $9000.00 per hour, the cutter, not so sure but right up there, so what $30,000 grand for ten min.race and a few thrills. There a solutions, but it will take time and energy. Sled neck

**allipp@…**12/13/21 #30684

I have a few things to add:

First, all the craft I saw in trouble needing to be saved were either rowing shells or sit inside kayaks. As far as I'm aware, not a single surfski or OC needed rescuing. I did see several SUP paddlers falling in, but they easily climbed back on and proceeded (many of them on their knees).

Second, the Coast Guard was already there hanging out. Perhaps knowing that there was a wind advisory in place and that a race was going on they decided to monitor the situataion and/or use it as a training day. Remember when you throw out numbers and costs of things, this can be somewhat disingenuous in that these are paid Federal employees that are going to get paid whether they are making a rescue or sitting in their headquarters on call. The notion that they put their lives at risk is certainly true, but in the case of the DP Dash the risk was minimal.

Third, the race director had numerous safety boats there, and they were actually the ones that made most of the rescues. I'd go as far as saying that even without any Coast Guard help everyone and their craft would have been saved, and even without any safety boats at all we would have been able to get everyone to shore, but a lot of shells and kayaks may have been left to float the seas.

**allipp@…** 12/13/21 #30686

From Darrell Kirk 206 Waterfolk:

Darrell Kirk\\
Yes, Rob had two large Coast Guard cutter on site before the race began. In addition he had a couple of large Skagit county Sheriff's boats on the scene before the race began. Coast Guard Auxiliary was there also along with search and rescue elements before the race began. All were called in for safety support weeks before the race. No one was called in.

**beau whitehead** 12/13/21 #30687

What do you think the insurance costs are for the multitude of channel crossing races in Hawaii? Maui to Molokai (which didn't even require PFD's until 3 years ago)… 3 hours, without land in site, 10-20' swell, and I didn't see a safety boat the entire crossing.\\
But, there's a vetting system. You can't enter unless you can show proof of previous ocean race finishes, OR a local respected paddler like Kai Bartlett or Jim Foti vouch for you.

Larry B, huge kudos to you for deciding not to race…. It's hard to do once you've paid to enter and made the drive. I wish more folks had made that decision Saturday. You had personal accountability and didn't rely on the race director to be your nanny.

**Paul Reavley **12/13/21 #30688

Deception Pass is the most dynamic and variable local paddling spot that I am at least somewhat familiar with. Because DP can have relatively benign (but interesting with the tidal currents) conditions at times and the race has been successfully operated many times in those conditions it lures paddlers with a large spectrum of open water experience to It. But we are talking about several significantly different races that some of us might like to see and participate in there.

A few more comments and questions about Saturday's race:

My congratulations also to Larry B. for choosing to stay on land. I believe he correctly anticipated similar conditions to some that he had not at all enjoyed at DP in the past (and Larry is a very experienced surfskier and sea kayaker). I suspect that a number of participants really had little idea of what was coming even though the wind arrived from the west in the neighborhood of timing, direction, and strength that I had seen predicted on the Windy app. This was not a fluke - conditions were exactly what they should have been given the arrival of the predicted wind. A Carter at the Gorge style pre-race talk probably would have been a good thing. I don't know how you give folks who don't have adequate experience a good idea of what was likely to be going on on the south and west facing side of Deception Island (and a number of people had trouble before ever getting that far) - but I suspect we can do a better job. I had my doubts before the race about sticking with race route #1 going around Deception Island, but I did not speak up.

What about the rest of the course and race? When I came back through Canoe Pass from the east side after being radioed that the race was being shut down I paddled through some very large, steep waves. They were all just fun in my OC with the exception of one where a bit of lip break caught me and made me lean as far forward and left (on my ama) as I could. In general I have found going against the west waves at Deception when the ebb is flowing easier than going with the waves - (at least for me) there is a big benefit in being able to see the cross directional waves coming at me. How do the backward-facing folks deal with the multi-directional stuff on the ebb tide that they likely would have been paddling through on the way back approaching and going around Deception at the end of the course? If the wind had arrived a little later and everyone got through most of the race and ran into this stuff headed back toward Deception Island with the growing ebb current how would this have all gone?

**Nicholas Cryder** 12/14/21 #30696

Beau, that is exactly my point: Without a vetting system, we won't be able to do the kind of racing we want to do. It gets a little tricky when someone from "outside the tribe" wants to attend a race - but not insurmountable.

Nicholas Cryder\\
**Toby Cooper **12/14/21 #30700

\\
“Vetting” may work for the Molokai because it’s a relatively unique, 30-mile open ocean crossing – potentially life-threatening by definition. What happened at DP was a function of a known, precisely-modelled, monster weather system moving N to S offshore of Vancouver Island, with predictable walls of wind at its front. That can happen at any of our races, including on lakes. How can you establish ratings and move up some kind of ratings-ladder when there is technically no race course that is safe from risks like this?

But more to the point, who is going to certify that Joe Shmo is hereby “vetted” to paddle at DP, because if something were to happen to Joe at DP with your “OK to race” in hand, you now own the liability.

**Kevin Olney** 12/14/21 #30701

This post covers the events at the Pass, the future of racing and some of the broader issues regarding safety and responsibility. Sorry for the length…

I grew up on North Whidbey Island. I was around 10 years old when my folks started boating. We would go camping on weekends in the San Juans throughout the summer months. There were many great memories but some of the most vivid were the white-knuckled rides through Deception Pass. On one particular trip we were returning from Sucia Island. It was warm and sunny as we crossed Rosario Straight but we could see a line of dark clouds moving in from the west. I was just learning about tides and weather forecasts and I got a lesson in both. Within minutes the wind picked up from almost zero to 15-20 knots westerly. As we approached Deception Island the pass had just begun to ebb and the sea state erupted into 8-10’ waves crashing into each other. We were getting tossed around in our 19’ Rienell but managed to motor into the safety of Cornet Bay without serious incident.

I was amazed at how quickly conditions changed. As a paddler I have experienced similar situations on more than one occasion. I have put myself and others at risk, stubbornly thinking “we will just make this short crossing before the weather moves in”. Since Saturday’s event I’ve been thinking about all the issues involved with the race itself as well as the underlying narrative and realized I have some stake in what happens going forward. We all do. Without going full novel I’ll try to break it down into these segments:

* Personal responsibility\\
* Obligations to others\\
* Responsibility of group leader/race director\\
* Decisions as a community and as a sport

1. At the heart of any safety discussion is the paddler’s responsibility to make good judgement calls. They must be honest about their abilities and experience level. They should have knowledge of weather, tides, currents, and local dangers for the waters they are in. I’m not saying you have to be a meteorologist and ocean geographer, just that you should have a solid enough understanding of local conditions to make prudent decisions.

And you MUST be able to SELF-RESCUE!!

I don’t think this one is up for debate. There are so many things that can go wrong in an emergency situation. Self rescue is one thing you have control over. If you are not 100% confident in your remount then practice until you are or hire your own chase boat. It’s not fair to put that one on your paddling partners, race directors or the CG. I won’t get into safety equipment, clothing, etc. There are already plenty of topics about that stuff.

2. Inevitably somebody next to you in a race or on a downwind run is going to need assistance. Maybe they are new and naive or old and crusty and haven’t practiced their remount in 10 years because they “never fall out of the boat”. You still feel an obligation to help. Obviously getting them back in their boat or radioing for assistance is necessary at this point but think about what lead to the situation. Was this person nervous before the race? Were they asking questions they should have known the answers too? Any history of similar incidents? I think we owe it to each other to be a lot more open to talking about go/no go decisions on land. Honestly, if you are feeling nervous before a downwinder that’s a big f’ing red flag. It’s ok to say something. No one is going to shame you for making a decision to protect your safety and theirs. Conversely, if you see an uncomfortable situation brewing, address it as soon as possible. This is where, as a group, we could have done better on Saturday. A lot of us knew what could, and likely would happen as the wind shifted to westerly. A lot of racers apparently had no idea what they were getting into.

3. Which brings me to the responsibilities of the group leader/race director. Man, its a tough job. You can talk about safety, describe course dangers, require PFDs, leashes, whistles, radio… whatever. People are still going to tune out or straight up ignore all the warnings. It doesn’t make you any less responsible for their safety. I’ve known Rob Casey for a number of years and attended many of his races and I think what he is doing for the sport is amazing. He put together the biggest fleet of safety crew that I’ve seen at any local race. I believe there were about 50 racers that started and he had at least 5 motorized safety boats and another 10 paddlers on OC, ski and SUP patrolling the course. That adds up to 1 safety boat for every 3.5 racers! I’ve done races in Hawaii where they may have had 1 boat for the whole race but I never saw it so I’m not even sure.

Race Report - On Saturday I opted not to race. I had tweaked my back the week before and was recovering well but still hesitant to go all out in the boat. I volunteered for safety crew, figuring I’d post up at Deception Island in the V-8, keep an eye on folks as they passed and catch some waves while I waited for them to return. Pre-race I met with the human powered safety crew and we discussed our positions on the course. I suggested I follow the first wave of racers at the 9:00 start out to the island to shadow the back of the pack. The slower boats started earlier to give them more time to get through the pass before the tide change. As the horn went off for the first wave the wind had been building for about 20 minutes but was still only around 10 knots. 1-2’ waves were rolling into Bowman Bay and growing steadily.

Immediately I could tell some folks were not going to make it through the pass as the paddle boarders were already down to their knees and some sea kayaks were moving at a snail’s pace. 20 minutes later the second heat started and soon came roaring by. We had barely past Reservation Head, less than 1/2 mile from the start. A few paddlers and a rower turned around but most kept humping their way towards Deception Island as the wave began to stack up to 6, 7, 8 feet. The wind had built to around 20 knots. Then I saw the first overturned rowing shell, then the next, and then I saw an OC and a couple of skis huli up ahead. Game on! I paddled up to the first shell as the Skagit Sheriffs approached and they began to rescue her so I paddled over to the next shell and he was actually able to remount on his own. Next I assisted a ski as he got turned around and headed back to shore. Then I saw a guy floating with no boat. I got to him about the same time as a SUP. The paddle boarder grabbed the dude while I went to retrieve his sea kayak.\\
About this time the call had been made to close the course so all the fast pack returned and began aiding in rescues as well. We tried for a bit to reunite the guy with his kayak but eventually the CG Aux came by and grabbed him. I paddled back to shore with one leg in his boat and even managed to catch a couple waves on the way.

The whole event lasted about 40 minutes and I never felt like anyone was ever in real danger despite the number of capsizes. If the wind had picked up half an hour later it could have been a different story. With racers spread out over a much larger area it is a lot harder to keep track of everyone.\\
It should be noted that all of the assistance and recoveries were preformed by boats or paddlers involved in the event. All the news reports swirling around completely fail to make this important distinction.

4. There are things we need to consider as a whole community. Of course we want these events to continue but how do we balance safety concerns and liability requirements with racer enjoyment and reasonable cost of entry? How do we maintain positive working relationships with the rescue agencies? How do we manage the press and public relations end of things when an event goes sideways and gets sensationalized in the news and social media? These are all on the table and the discussion is ongoing.

Personally, I think that some level of vetting is probably appropriate for races such as DP, Rough Water, Bainbridge Island or any future downwind events we come up with. I have no idea what this looks like or how to implement it. At the same time we need to have inclusive races like Lk Whatcom and Salmon Row to give less experienced paddlers an opportunity to grow into the sport.\\
Working with the authorities is another important point. The Skagit Sheriffs and Skagit Bay SAR have supported La Conner for many years and are enthusiastic about the event every year. Keeping them in the loop benefits everyone.\\
Unfortunately I believe the cold reality is that the cost of races is going to have to increase. Sound Rowers and other local races have done an amazing job for decades of providing low cost, highly competitive events based on a super low overhead model and a ton of volunteer effort. The costs of safety boats, insurance, permits and basically everything keeps going up so we need to understand that entry fees will have to do the same or there just won’t be any races.

As for the bad press, I’m at a loss. Maybe if people paddled more and griped on social media less their lives would be happier?\\
On a final note I just want to remind everyone how lucky we are to have such an inspiring group of personalities around us to share their wisdom and experiences. I appreciate you all. Please keep the conversation going.

Happy Holidays and see you at La Conner (Cat 5),

Kevin O

**Toby Cooper** 12/14/21 #30702

Many thanks to KO for this thoughtful analysis. And to Nicholas for the challenge to think Big. I think we are getting somewhere.

I was not at DP and am only in this discussion because we had a fatality in the Bay Area just before I moved to Orcas. It involved a competent paddler on a Sunday downwinder, and that moment stimulated this same kind of search for a better way.

KO is right, self-rescue is the key. Vetting will not help with liability issues if it becomes a judgement-call on competence. However, if vetting involves certification that someone meets some designated standard of safety, then that sets a bar that is equal for everybody and does not create liability for the race organizer.

There are probably two parts to the certification; 1) proof of possession – and use – of required safety equipment (PFD/leash/cold water gear), and, 2) proficiency of remount.

If we can organize ourselves so that all racers have to achieve those two things, and if we can show the Coasties and the insurance companies that we have implemented those requirements, we will be a long way towards remaining in charge of our own destiny.

The best thing we did in recent years is when KO built remounts into one of his Hot Five races at MP. We need more of that.

I am willing to help, like, write up a work plan or help administer on-the-water remount testing. Whatever it takes. Thanks.

**paul clement** 12/14/21 #30705

Kevin’s post is perhaps the most important and comprehensive I have read on Whatcom Paddlers.

He’s not a Prima Donna that believes racing should be for the few AND he was in the water helping on the day AND he puts on races.

I decided to not go to Deception Pass because the forecast looked to be above my skill level. My decision was based largely on my past experience (some of which Kevin was on hand for). I think it was a good call. Hopefully others have gained that experience.\\
If the badass elite paddlers want to promote events for the very few, then have at it. But don’t just bitch about the current situation, put on an event. Maybe have a “go at all cost” category and a “go to work on Monday” category. I’ll pay and bail if it’s too big and understand.\\
I prefer to “race” with the masses at mass start all comers events that are well managed. If that makes me a lesser person who has not dedicated my life to paddling, then so be it.

So, I hope Rob Casey, Sound Rowers, KO, Peter Marcus and PNWORCA continue putting on great events because they are fun.\\
pc

**Nicholas Cryder** 12/15/21 #30707

At present, I think it's safe to say we have the flatwater racing scene dialed with a calendar full of nice, family oriented events that are beginner and potluck friendly. I am not diminishing the importance of those events.

But apart from the Gorge, downwind racing in the continental US is vastly underrepresented and yet is a huge part of the essence of what surfskis, outriggers and foiling SUP are designed for. I am asking the downwind minded paddling community if / when we should be thinking about trying to create some structure to facilitate and promote downwind racing. By facilitate I mean an ordered and fair structure that enables downwind minded race organizers with safety, sponsorship, insurance, logistics and racer vetting.

Nicholas Cryder

**John Rybczyk **12/15/21 #30712

On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 10:05 AM, Nicholas Cryder wrote:

But apart from the Gorge, downwind racing in the continental US is vastly underrepresented and yet is a huge part of the essence of what surfskis, outriggers and foiling SUP are designed for. I am asking the downwind minded paddling community if / when we should be thinking about trying to create some structure to facilitate and promote downwind racing.

I’m not convinced that, around here (the Puget Sound), downwind racing can ever be much of a thing. We just don’t have consistent downwind conditions, like the Gorge, for example. Yes, we have wonderful down-wind conditions, frequently, but not predictably (in the context of planning a race). Take the Dan Harris Challenge, for example. We run that course in exactly the same location where many of us frequently enjoy very, very good…and sometimes epic…downwind conditions. Yet in the fifteen years I’ve run that race, we’ve had exactly one race where we had proper downwind conditions for the run back from Chuckanut Island to Boulevard Park. So, we are left with either having local-knowledge, last minute races when the conditions present themselves (we’ve done that a few times), or having races with big race-windows (like the Gorge) which, I think, would be untenable for most race directors given that they are mostly volunteers and hold down other jobs. But don't feel sad. I disagree with the premise that surfskis are designed for downwind racing. They are designed for downwinding. And we can still do that. A lot.

**Paul Reavley** 12/15/21 #30713

I completely agree with John, but I would rather not discount the potential for creativity that someone might demonstrate in finding ways to get around the fact that our part of the world needs a much wider race window than places with winds that have their own names.

I also prefer to think of this discussion as one about how to promote downwinding and paddling. But it does seem like competition tends to go hand in glove in the development and growth of many if not most sports these days.

The first ideas that spring to my mind in terms of how one might approach the weather window challenge:

1) Have an organized series of races which increase the odds that at least one of the series races will hit on favorable conditions. Maybe for the organizer's economics people would have to sign up for at least several if not all of the races? (Ironically 2 of the 3 [[:races:columbia_gorge_races|Gorge Vortex races]] last year turned out to be flat water, although if you were there you did get some wind on some other days)

2) Virtual downwind races with wide windows (allowing as many attempts as one can manage) before the final data compilation.

Advantages

  - huge flexibility for the participants and their personal schedules
  - "Virtual" elimination of liability and most other organizer concerns, overhead, and time expenditure
  - could they charge small entry fees that could go entirely toward prizes and/or promotion of the sport via donations to junior programs, development of water access, webcams, etc.?

Disadvantages

  - doesn't provide the head to head competition that many racers thrive on
  - conditions for racers will never be equivalent unless some go out in their own small groups at the same times. (if we require a specific course to be paddled, then there is somewhat more equivalence but that then reduces the appeal to non-locals? and loses some flexibility for paddlers)

 \\ Maybe the lack of appeal of limited head to head competition could also be somewhat overcome by offering creative prizes (particularly if we can get donations of such prizes) such as a race entry option (you still have to pay, this just affords you the chance) for some exclusive race like the next Gorge Championship (don't laugh, if/when it gets back into full swing again those race entry slots are probably going to become rarer and rare commodities)

??

**Tyler Irwin**  12/16/21 #30714

I’m going to be the grinch here but I hope that after 2021 is over, I never hear the term ‘Virtual Race’ ever again.

The whole concept is fraught with avenues to cheat, and doesn’t even present real competition.

Can it be used for fundraising? Sure. Racing? No way.

**Dennis Mowry**  12/16/21 #30715

Thanks to everyone who put on and volunteer for the races. Making our community more fun, social and welcoming.

Here's my $.02: \\ It would be great to have races in bigger conditions. Races are often modified to suit everybody or those with least experience. They also have long courses and short courses. For those who are conditioned and those aah want to race a shorter race. Would it be possible to have strong and a sheltered course in the same race? Put the safety boats in the sheltered course. Claim releases in the strong, or whatever could work. \\ Have an unofficial big water race? \\ We could still have the kid friendly potluck. \\ It's only $.02 suggestion, \\ :D'

 \\ **Toby Cooper **12/16/21 #30716

On the other hand, that 2020 P4F was kind of fun. It made inventive cheating part of the game. People went down wind, down current, whatever looked fast. I thought somebody would do a K4.

**Paul Reavley **12/16/21 #30718

While Virtual Races were used to provide something in place of canceled races during the last couple of years (and it was a bit of a pale shadow for that), the concept I am talking about here is someway to add a whiff of competition in downwinding locally (yeah, I know, there are plenty of local folks that always include competition in any downwind run you do with them). I was not talking about replacing any of our existing races, just brainstorming any way to take a bit of advantage of our excellent but intermittent local downwinding conditions that make scheduling an organized downwind race locally highly impractical.

That's why it's called "virtual" - it clearly isn't the real deal. If we don't award prizes and just use any money involved for fundraising then that should take away any serious recriminations aimed toward suspected cheaters. Cheating has typically not been a huge concern for me - particularly in virtual races. I tend to be more bothered by obnoxious behavior in "real" races. To my mind the bigger problem with virtual races may be simple incompetence in understanding and setting a correct course length and accurately measuring your outcome. But if you are doing a downwind virtual race it is not necessarily a bad idea to have a similar speed buddy or two for some safety and to keep your results honest. Races by twos or threes?

**Kimberly Reeves**  12/16/21 #30720

As someone that has been fully engaged in Zoomlandia the past couple of years…I’d rather live in the Metaverse than to “compete” \\ In another virtual race in the Matrix. \\ Living in 3D \\ Kim

**Michael Lampi **12/16/21 #30721

While it's definitely not the same thing as an on the water race - which I also greatly prefer - Concept2 offers an apparently free online service that enables people to compete using their machines and apps against each other in real time. I guess it's sort of like what one can do with Peloton. Anyway, during the cooler weather these days it might be something to consider.

**Ian Daykin**  12/16/21 #30722

Hi folks,

Your neighbor on Van isle here.

My big idea: For some time now, I've thought about how cool it would be to run a DW race here on the island in the Juan de Fuca Strait. Maybe even run a Canadian Downwind Champs scale race here.

In my humble opinion, the JDF strait is the next best thing to the Gorge for consistent downwinds in the PNW. The winter is great because there's days where big swells and wind all roll down the strait in the perfect direction, but spring/summer is when the wind gets consistent. My buddy here took note that he paddled 18 times in the month of July this year and 16 of them were either laps or downwinds. A few years back I tried to organize a local Thursday Night Race and we had 11 Thursdays in a row where it was blowing too hard to do a normal course and we just did laps. It's still never a guarantee when you pick a date/time on the calendar, but it blows… often.

The biggest barriers to moving forward: \\ -Safety: The cold here is no joke (even in the summer), emergency takes outs can be tricky (rocky coastline without direct road access), a Sheringham Run involves being at least 3km off shore, it's typically afternoons/evenings when it's blowing so morning starts probably aren't an option. \\ -Liability/insurance: ???…. truck me a rhino (I use this phrase when I don't want to swear around the tikes.) \\ -Who would come?: Taking ferries adds cost/time and then as discussed earlier, if it's blowing hard, this would not be beginner friendly. We have a very small crew of paddlers here.

I don't know when or if this will ever come to fruition, but there's the idea. An alternative that focuses on paddling rather than racing would be to have some kind of week long DW camp or event. People camp at French Beach or Jordan River and then do DW's right from their campsite. Perhaps an informal race at some point during the week…

Ian
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